Why aren't you playing?

[The Other Dave]

Sidenote: The thing about Epic is that I have a full set of rules before I even play the game. Also some of the entry items are modestly priced and look easy enough to paint. Oops! I think I'm screwed already.

And I haven't even posted links to the many many alternative manufacturers of 6mm sci-fi ranges! (Not to mention that even straight from GW my entire Eldar force was something less than 20,000 yen, or that stupidly cheap lots of all kinds of Epic stuff turn up regularly on eBay.)

(Sorry for the derail, I just couldn't pass up the chance to sink the hooks in. )

[Colonel Voss]

Roman era, Epic 40k, Cutlass all look to be great games. As I am isolated and have low funding, picking and choosing is hard. So far I have kept to Warhammer Fantasy/40k (maybe too many armies though ), Flames of War (though I need a second army to get painting practice in before I tackle my first army ), Firestorm Armada (bought when prim was looking into it and then got hit by an amnesia ray and went with Dystopian) and I have the beginning of Warmachine. I think that is enough for now.

[Primarch]

Firestorm Armada (bought when prim was looking into it and then got hit by an amnesia ray and went with Dystopian) and I have the beginning of Warmachine. I think that is enough for now.

It was more to do with the fact that there are 2 people in Nagoya who play DW and at the time I could only afford one game. I didnt forget, I just had to prioritise. Gomen.
Which fleet did you buy, I will add a fleet to my shopping list next time I place an order as it IS something I would like to try.

A number of others can be accused of trying to subconsciously spread Warmahordes.:

Yep, I play that, its a good game and it has more players than anything beyond WFB and 40K at the moment. It's not exactly subconscious.

I hear 40kers are trying to resuscitate that game.

Implying that people ever stopped playing it. I have played 4 games in the past month. What happened to your Chaos Marines? Just because you cant be bothered to play it doesnt mean that no-one does.

But, you, Prim, peddle soooo many games. I have to watch out for you!:

The only thing I have 'peddled' at Joshin is Cutlass. Dust Tactics needs no purchase from anyone else to play and Dystopian Wars I bought to play with Ennui and I have never tried to convince you or anyone else to buy. I admit that I post up links to new, cool stuff as and when I happen across it on the internet. If it catches your attention then thats fine, if you aren't interested, that is cool too.

The thing about Epic is that I have a full set of rules before I even play the game. Also some of the entry items are modestly priced and look easy enough to paint.

Epic currently has 1 player, (It would be 2 but we disagree about the edition to play), the same guy who is tempting you with 6mm Napoleonics and that you are trying to get more into FoW. (No offence ToD).

Whilst I know you have passed judgement on me as some kind of whirlwind of model buying, game pushing, ADD suffering hobby maniac, I think you have misjudged me somewhat.

My current list of projects:
Keeping Cutlass going at Joshin.
Painting my Napoleonic models for a game in November with Ashmie.
Keeping the Grand Campaign up to date.
Getting my Chaos Space Marines built. (I have 3 vehicles to go and I am done).
Painting individual models, chosen from all my games when I need to take a break from doing units.
So thats one building project, one painting, one gaming, one thing I do on my PC twice a month and something I do to break the monotony of batch painting. Is it a lot of things? Yeah. Do I expect you or anyone else to do anything? Only Cutlass.
There are things I would like to do in the future, so I test the waters occasionally with threads like this one to see what other people are interested in trying.

[The Other Dave]

Epic currently has 1 player, (It would be 2 but we disagree about the edition to play), the same guy who is tempting you with 6mm Napoleonics and that you are trying to get more into FoW. (No offence ToD).

None taken! I'm actually resigned to the fact that it's pretty unlikely anyone will really take up the game, let alone a group of people. Dead games are a hard sell, no matter how awesome their rules for command / control and suppression. And what with you guys apparently going for Napoleonics in the eminently-silly 28mm scale ( ) I doubt Mike and my interest in 6mm Napoleonics will go very far either - especially since neither of us seem to have actually painting our forces as a very high priority.

[job]

Firestorm Armada (bought when prim was looking into it and then got hit by an amnesia ray and went with Dystopian) and I have the beginning of Warmachine. I think that is enough for now.

It was more to do with the fact that there are 2 people in Nagoya who play DW and at the time I could only afford one game. I didnt forget, I just had to prioritise. Gomen.
Which fleet did you buy, I will add a fleet to my shopping list next time I place an order as it IS something I would like to try.

A number of others can be accused of trying to subconsciously spread Warmahordes.:

Yep, I play that, its a good game and it has more players than anything beyond WFB and 40K at the moment. It's not exactly subconscious.

I hear 40kers are trying to resuscitate that game.

Implying that people ever stopped playing it. I have played 4 games in the past month. What happened to your Chaos Marines? Just because you cant be bothered to play it doesnt mean that no-one does.

But, you, Prim, peddle soooo many games. I have to watch out for you!:

The only thing I have 'peddled' at Joshin is Cutlass. Dust Tactics needs no purchase from anyone else to play and Dystopian Wars I bought to play with Ennui and I have never tried to convince you or anyone else to buy. I admit that I post up links to new, cool stuff as and when I happen across it on the internet. If it catches your attention then thats fine, if you aren't interested, that is cool too.

The thing about Epic is that I have a full set of rules before I even play the game. Also some of the entry items are modestly priced and look easy enough to paint.

Epic currently has 1 player, (It would be 2 but we disagree about the edition to play), the same guy who is tempting you with 6mm Napoleonics and that you are trying to get more into FoW. (No offence ToD).

Whilst I know you have passed judgement on me as some kind of whirlwind of model buying, game pushing, ADD suffering hobby maniac, I think you have misjudged me somewhat.

My current list of projects:
Keeping Cutlass going at Joshin.
Painting my Napoleonic models for a game in November with Ashmie.
Keeping the Grand Campaign up to date.
Getting my Chaos Space Marines built. (I have 3 vehicles to go and I am done).
Painting individual models, chosen from all my games when I need to take a break from doing units.
So thats one building project, one painting, one gaming, one thing I do on my PC twice a month and something I do to break the monotony of batch painting. Is it a lot of things? Yeah. Do I expect you or anyone else to do anything? Only Cutlass.
There are things I would like to do in the future, so I test the waters occasionally with threads like this one to see what other people are interested in trying.

Sesh, you seem to have taken kind of strong. I was just joking about most of it. You did ask why we weren't joining, and I'm just saying that I can't have too many projects.

Anyway, one other point is whether the rules are accessible or not determines whether I play or not, especially these kind of "side games". I don't want to be throwing money at rule books and if they are free I can go straight for models without any "entry" costs.

As for these things:

Yep, I play that, its a good game and it has more players than anything beyond WFB and 40K at the moment. It's not exactly subconscious.

I wrote about recruitment. The Warmahorde guys and gals are really nice. (Well, most of them, neh? ) They seem to be welcoming, but they were also nice to warn me about the realities of collecting their system.

Implying that people ever stopped playing it. I have played 4 games in the past month. What happened to your Chaos Marines? Just because you cant be bothered to play it doesnt mean that no-one does.

I stand by what I said. If you need some specification, I would say "It is currently dead/comatose within the Nagoya-area." All your games were in Mie and/or from Mie-players. Those guys have kept their interest peaked while at Joshin it will be played for the first time in four-months, if I am correct.
The CSM project is on the shelf. I've got a cool looking DP and I sometimes look at the Berzerkers. But without opponents and, more importantly, a 40k scene, I'm not interested. I hope things pick up well before next years Nagoyahammer, but maybe it will take some excitement amongst the community to get people to bring this game back out into the light.

[Colonel Voss]

I of course try my best to peddle FOW, and now Voss is like my Seki- doppelganger.

I prefer to think of myself as an evil twin.

Prim: I bought Aquan Prime

As for 40k, I know I don't count for much down in Nagoya but I have several armies if anyone wants to come up and face off against me.

[Primarch]

Epic currently has 1 player, (It would be 2 but we disagree about the edition to play), the same guy who is tempting you with 6mm Napoleonics and that you are trying to get more into FoW. (No offence ToD).

None taken! I'm actually resigned to the fact that it's pretty unlikely anyone will really take up the game, let alone a group of people. Dead games are a hard sell, no matter how awesome their rules for command / control and suppression. And what with you guys apparently going for Napoleonics in the eminently-silly 28mm scale ( ) I doubt Mike and my interest in 6mm Napoleonics will go very far either - especially since neither of us seem to have actually painting our forces as a very high priority.

What can I say, I just like to be able to see my minis on the tabletop. (My eyesight isnt great after all). At the time, I was kind of irritated that neither of you had told me that you were going to start playing because if you had, I would have bought an army too. My choice of 28mm comes down to having cheap models, which look nice and a fair amount of "well screw you guys" if I'm being honest.
It seems though that neither you nor Mike have shown much enthusiasm after you bought the models, which is a shame. It woud be nice to see how your game plays out.
There are only 2 people involved in 28mm and 2 in 6mm so it could still go either way I guess. Black Powder would let you use your models in a game with me so long as we could form units with roughly the same frontage. It would look strange, but its certainly playable. Scale and number of models is an aesthetic choice in BP.

I stand by what I said. If you need some specification, I would say "It is currently dead/comatose within the Nagoya-area." All your games were in Mie and/or from Mie-players. Those guys have kept their interest

Ah, but I am in Nagoya and I am playing. 2 of my games were in Nagoya, 1 in Gifu and 1 in Mie.

Anyway, one other point is whether the rules are accessible or not determines whether I play or not, especially these kind of "side games". I don't want to be throwing money at rule books and if they are free I can go straight for models without any "entry" costs.

Sadly many games companies dont share your sentiment. Epic Armageddon is only free because GW dont produce it anymore. Malifaux and Dust Tactics both have free rule sets though, and the Victrix and Infinity models I have bought also came with a free rules sheet. I notice that I cant get FoW books for free from Battlefront and it seems that there are rather a lot of them depending on which week of the conflict you want to play. I think asking companies to spend time and money developing rules and publishing them, then asking them to give them out for free is unrealistic for the most part. So long as the rules dont cost a lot and you can get them in 1 book rather than spread across dozens it shouldnt really be an issue.

[The Other Dave]

At the time, I was kind of irritated that neither of you had told me that you were going to start playing because if you had, I would have bought an army too. My choice of 28mm comes down to having cheap models, which look nice and a fair amount of "well screw you guys" if I'm being honest.

That's fair. It was a spur-of-the-moment impulse buy for both of us, I think, heh.

Chances are actually good I'll get to painting them seriously soon. I'm through my Epic backlog, and can only buy FoW stuff in dribs and drabs.

[job]

Sadly many games companies dont share your sentiment. Epic Armageddon is only free because GW dont produce it anymore. Malifaux and Dust Tactics both have free rule sets though, and the Victrix and Infinity models I have bought also came with a free rules sheet. I notice that I cant get FoW books for free from Battlefront and it seems that there are rather a lot of them depending on which week of the conflict you want to play. I think asking companies to spend time and money developing rules and publishing them, then asking them to give them out for free is unrealistic for the most part. So long as the rules dont cost a lot and you can get them in 1 book rather than spread across dozens it shouldnt really be an issue.

Actually, I don't think it is unfeasible to ask gaming companies to release rules for free or at least at a low price. Maybe with publishing and binding it costs something, but internet pdfs really don't create costs of production and delivery. So you are down to just the cost of experimenting and writing the rules. Granted staff for writing, producing art, and editing takes time and money, I'm still not convinced GW or any gaming company ever lacks for commitment amongst their staff to play test rules and ideas.

I think it is completely feasible for a gaming company to release rules and written materials without or limited charges. Gaming companies ought to be primarily creating revenues from model sales, accessories to gaming and hobby materials. A number of far more expensive industries have shown that even with far more capital intensive endeavors, such as MMPGs, social networking sites and others, that you can make your revenues without charging for every service you provide. Rules could either be partly or wholly provided without cost in my belief.

Anyway, why keep fighting the change in technology. GW codexes and armybooks already float around for free. Most gamers don't invest beyond their faction's book and then have compilations of books for other factions on their hard drives.

[Primarch]

Granted staff for writing, producing art, and editing takes time and money, I'm still not convinced GW or any gaming company ever lacks for commitment amongst their staff to play test rules and ideas.

So their games development team should be doing it for free because they like the company? What about companies like Black Scorpion, who are primarily a minis company and who have to contract out to a developer to write the rules for them. Even pdfs need some kind of editing and artwork (both of those cost money too). Then you have storage space on the internet for your files. Paying for hosting and for bandwidth costs money. After that, you'd better be hoping that all your customers have an iPad or a Kindle. I dont think Joshin has enough power outlets for all of us to run PCs, and I am certainly not dragging my desktop to a game. Maybe I should invest in a 50000 yen notebook PC so that I can read rulebooks for free, rather than paying the 3000 yen for the book? If I want to print something out? That costs me money too. Its certainly cheaper assuming that I dont use nice glossy paper or have colour pictures. I'll need to get a folder to put it in and take with me to games.
You know what, I'll just stick with the rulebooks cheers. They're not actually that expensive unless you're buying Forge World's massive hard back tomes or every single Flames of War book, having a book in hand is much more convenient than any of the portable pdf readers I have seen (my armybook doesnt lock itself if I dont touch it for 5 minutes) and dont break if a box of models gets put on them. Given the cost of models, rulebooks are relatively cheap anyway.