Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, etc.

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The Other Dave
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Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, etc.

Post by The Other Dave » Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:16 am

(Also, maybe most importantly, keeping interest up, heh.)

A recent post by MiJ reminded me that maybe I ought to remind people that this thing is, in fact, still going to happen. :lol: I'll post a third and final thread when I get the room reservation (knock on wood) but at the moment we're going forward with a Saturday 8 December date.

I thought I'd use this thread to introduce the forces I have available a little bit, let all you interested parties talk amongst yourselves to figure out which armies you want to borrow, that sort of thing. I've broken my forces up into three tiers, depending on how "newbie friendly" I think they are. In terms of how they play on the board, Epic does (IMO) do a good job of modeling how the 40K armies play, so nothing should be too surprising, but at the scale Epic plays at, some wrinkles do come through for some armies. Posts follow.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by The Other Dave » Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:19 am

Group 1: Newbie-Friendly

Group 1a: Newbie-Friendly on Account of Having No Special Rules

Imperial Guard Armored Regiment

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➢ Tank Company: 7 Leman Russes, including the Regimental Commander, and 3 Demolishers
➢ Self-Propelled Artillery Company: 9 Basilisks, with an attached Hydra Flak Tank
➢ Super-Heavy Tank Company: 3 Stormswords
➢ Self-Propelled Artillery Platoon: 3 Manticores
➢ Salamander Scout Platoon: 3 Salamander Scout Vehicles and a Salamander Command Vehicle
➢ Storm Trooper Platoon: 8 stands of Storm Troopers in 4 Valkyries
➢ Super-Heavy Tank Platoon: 1 Shadowsword
➢ Thunderbolt Squadron: 2 Thunderbolt Fighters
Imperial Guard are pretty much by definition the baseline Epic experience – the army has no special rules whatsoever. They pretty reliably do whatever you want, less so if they’ve been coming under a lot of fire. The tank legion has, as you would expect, lots of very hard tanks and lots of very powerful artillery, with only a few infantry – in this case, storm troopers in Valkyries, so the infantry they get is on the elite side. Generally mobile, well-armored and shooty, with some rapid-response units to grab objectives or otherwise strike where the enemy is weak (or has been weakened by overwhelming artillery barrages). This particular army, with its Demolishers and Stormswords, likes to get up-close and personal, and should have relatively little trouble blasting infantry out of defensive positions. Things to watch out for: This army doesn’t really have any tricksy bits. The Salamanders are a true scout unit and Not For Fighting – keep them back and use them to seize or contest objectives late in the game. Keep the Manticores near the Basilisk company for the AA support, as it only takes a single casualty to break them.

Adeptus Mechanicus Planetary Defense Force
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➢ Ordinatus Majoris: Ordinatus Golgotha (slow, well-shielded ICBM platform)
➢ Ordinatus Minoris Company: 3 Knights Castellan (slow, well-shielded war engines with big cannons)
➢ Skitarii Demi-Century: 10 stands of Hypaspists (cybernetically modified thralls), led by a Tech Lord, with an attached Hydra Flak Tank
➢ Skitarii Demi-Century: 10 stands of Hypaspists, led by a Tech Priest, with an attached Hydra Flak Tank
➢ Skitarii Demi-Century: 10 stands of Hypaspists, led by a Tech Priest, mounted in Chimedons (Chimeras with upgraded cannons and reduced carrying capacity)
➢ Forge Knight Squadron: 6 Forge Knights
➢ Forge Knight Squadron: 3 Forge Knights
This is basically an elite Guard force, but a lot more static than the Armored Regiment, with a couple of big infantry formations on foot and lots of ponderous war engines, so will require a bit more of a defensive playstyle. It has nothing in the way of rapid response, and more of a reliance on footslogging infantry (which is on the elite side) than the armored regiment. But the Ordinatus put out a lot of firepower, so coordinated attacks – heavy artillery barrages followed up by assaults from infantry or forge knights – will be the most powerful tool in your arsenal. Ruleswise, it’s quite similar to the Guard force – no special rules, baseline reliability under fire. Things to watch out for: Your Forge Knight squadrons, although hard, will break under enough fire, especially the smaller one. Use them carefully. The Ordinatus Minoris can only fire directly, and are very slow, so set them up carefully.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by The Other Dave » Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:21 am

Group 1b: Newbie-Friendly on Account of Having Special Rules that Only Support the Army Playstyle

Ork Warhorde

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➢ Big Warband: 4 stands of Nobs, including the Warlord, 12 stands of Boyz and 4 stands of Grotz, with a Flakwagon attached
➢ Two Warbands, each with: 2 stands of Nobs, 6 stands of Boyz and 2 stands of Grotz mounted up in 3 Battlewagons, a Big Mek Gunwagon with a Supa-Zzap Gun, and a Flakwagon
➢ Big Kult of Speed: 8 stands of Warbikes and 8 Warbuggies
➢ A Gargant
➢ Huge Blitz Brigade: 9 Gunwagons, 2 Big Mek Gunwagons with Soopaguns, and a Flakwagon
➢ Mekboy Gunzmob: 5 Big Gunz and a stand of Nobz
➢ Fighta Skwadron: 3 Fighta-Bommas
Very straightforward force, with a few special rules to enforce and emphasize Orkiness. They’ll do whatever you want without hesitation, as long as what you want is for them to rush headlong towards the enemy shooting wildly and stomp heads once they get there. If there are enough of them, and if they have enough nobs to smack heads together, they’re pretty much the best there is at shrugging off the effects of fire – if there’re only a few of them left, not so much. Big, mobile formations, inaccurate firepower (exacerbated by their desire to move really fast towards the enemy), generally not-so-great armor. Things to watch out for: This army doesn’t really have any traps to fall into. Be aware that your shooting will often be wildly innacurate. The Gargant works better as an assaulting unit than as a gun platform for this reason.

Tyranids
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➢ A Dominatrix
➢ Assault Swarm: 2 stands of Tyranid Warriors, 3 Zoanthropes, 3 Exocrines, 4 stands of Termagants, 4 stands of Hormagaunts, and 2 stands of Gargoyles
➢ Big Assault Swarm: 4 stands of Tyranid Warriors, 12 stands of Termagants, 4 stands of Hormagaunts, and 3 Haruspexes
➢ Nest Swarm: 1 Hive Nest (tough synapse node), 4 stands of Termagants, 3 Biovores, and 3 Dactylises
➢ Big Brute Swarm: 2 Hive Tyrants, 3 Carnifexes, and 3 Malefactors
➢ Harrassment Swarm: Harridan and 6 stands of Gargoyles
➢ Lictor Swarm: 7 Lictors
Also very straightforward as a whole, although there are a few finesse units. What the Tyranids do best is move quickly and swarm the opponent under an avalanche of claws, and they do that very well indeed. They have little care for morale, especially with enough ablative gaunts to soak up fire, but will find themselves in several kinds of trouble if they lose their synapse connections – without synapse units, gaunt kills suddenly count for morale, and formations without synapses can’t hold objectives at all. They have some surprisingly good shooty units, but half of your formations have no shooting attacks to speak of and must get into an assault to do anything – which will need some care as Tyranids, although speedy on foot, have no transports. Things to watch out for: You have a few potentially nasty units you’ll have to use carefully – the Dominatrix is extremely scary but doesn’t have a whole lot of damage points, will fall to enough sustained fire (which she will probably get because she’s extremely scary), and isn’t as overwhelming in an assault as you might like – take advantage of her Commander ability and perform combined assaults where you can. Lictors can appear anywhere – once. Great for preemptively taking out artillery and the like, but they can get quickly shredded once they arrive. The gargoyles in the Harridan have a long threat range but are not so great unsupported. Also, Tyranids have no fliers and very limited AA, so your opponent will likely be enjoying air superiority.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by The Other Dave » Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:24 am

Group 2: Tricksy, My Preciousss

Necrons

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➢ Two Infantry Phalanxes, each with: 3 stands of Immortals including a Necron Lord, 6 stands of Necron Warriors, a stand of Pariahs, and 3 Tomb Spyders
➢ A Pylon
➢ Three Monolith Maniples, each with: 2 Monoliths and 2 Obelisks (which predate and basically have the same battlefield role as Doomsday Arks - vehicles a bit less hard than monoliths with a long-range tankbusting weapon)
➢ An Aeonic Orb (Tetrahedron, whatever. Orbs are hard to scratchbuild, heh.)
➢ A Tomb Complex (a special objective with a portal)
These guys are sort of the wildcard, since I’ve never actually played a game with them yet. But they have solid, elite infantry formations which will be very hard to shift once they get dug into cover (they do indeed bring destroyed units back into play, and the way a few of their rules work together means the infantry formations will want to play defensively), rock-hard vehicles, and a war engine that’s basically this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6ZbKjxn7p8 On the other hand, they’re quite slow (unless they’re utilizing their portal network), and have an annoying tendency to disappear from the battlefield entirely when coming under heavy fire. Things to watch out for: The Monolith formations, although hard as nails, are quite small, and can be broken by enough sustained fire even if they don’t take any casualties. As the Monoliths and their Portals are your main form of transport for your troops, you’ll want to be careful with them. Your entire army’s inability to take March orders means objective snatching (and countering same) will be difficult. This is also the only army with no Supreme Commander to give you an Initiative re-roll each turn – I thought a big old star-in-a-box would be more fun than a C’tan.

Blood Angels
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➢ Death Company: 4 stands of Death Company led by a Chaplain, in 2 Rhinos.
➢ Tactical Detachment: 6 stands of Tactical Marines, led by the Chapter Master, in 3 Land Raiders
➢ Tactical Detachment: 6 stands of Tactical Marines, led by a Chaplain, in 3 Stormraven Gunships
➢ Devastator Detachment: 4 stands of Devastators, led by a Librarian, in 2 Land Raiders
➢ Assault Detachment: 8 stands of Assault Marines, led by a Chaplain, in a Thunderhawk
➢ Whirlwind Detachment: 4 Whirlwinds and a Hunter
➢ Thunderbolt Squadron: 2 Thunderbolt Fighters
Marines in Epic have to be used carefully. They’re very mobile – the way Epic works, being able to rapidly redeploy in Rhinos (or Land Raiders, Stormravens or Thunderhawks) is very powerful, and Marines have it in spades. Individual marines, as you’d guess, are as good as other armies’ specialist units at anything they choose to do, and Chaplains, Captains and Librarians add a big punch. But, they have tiny tiny formations that, although they take a lot of work to suppress and are very reliable, won’t stand up to sustained shooting and will generally be outnumbered in an assault. Also they don’t have access to much in the way of war engines or titan-killer weapons, which means they can struggle against armor-heavy forces. Blood Angels also are a tad more unreliable than baseline marines in some circumstances, with a strong preference for launching an assault if they’re in range to do so. Things to watch out for: Timing on the Thunderhawk assault may be tricky, as an unsupported assault detachment will rapidly whither to sustained fire, and the Death Company will need to stick close to the Chapter Master (and his Combined Assault ability) as they are far too few to be very effective in an assault on their own.

Eldar
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➢ Aspect Warrior Warhost: 2 stands each of Dire Avengers, Striking Scorpions, Howling Banshees and Dark Reapers, including a Dark Reaper Exarch and a Howling Banshee Autarch, in 4 Wave Serpents
➢ Guardian Warhost: 1 stand of Warlocks led by a Farseer, 4 stands of Guardians, and 3 Scatter Laser Platforms, in 4 Wave Serpents
➢ Guardian Warhost: 1 stand of Warlocks led by a Farseer, 7 stands of Guardians, 3 D-Cannon Platforms, and 2 stands of Wraithguard
➢ Ranger Troupe: 8 stands of Rangers
➢ Swords of Vaul Troupe: 3 Fire Prisms, 2 Falcons, and a Firestorm
➢ Engines of Vaul Troupe: 2 Scorpions
➢ 2 Revenant Scout Titans
➢ An Avatar
➢ A Wraithgate (a special objective with a webway portal)
Eldar have some special rules that you’ll have to take advantage of to not die terribly. As you’d expect, they’re very specialized, very fast, and very very fragile. Aspect Warriors (and even Guardians with their shuriken catapults, warlocks and wraithguard support) are unrivaled in an assault but have almost no conventional shooting attacks. Falcons and Fire Prisms are mobile and shooty, but if you try to use them like main battle tanks they’ll evaporate under enemy fire. Superheavies and titans are very mobile (for war engines), well-armored (for Eldar), and very shooty indeed (by any measure), but again won’t stand up to sustained fire. Fortunately, the big Eldar rule-bend in Epic is the ability to shoot-and-scoot, so if you’re careful you can stay out of harm’s way. But you have to be careful. (Side-note: This army list is actually a good deal less tricky than it could be, since it only uses the one, static, Wraithgate for the unmounted Guardians to deploy through. For a similar points cost I could have all 3 Warhosts on reserves in the webway, and supplement the Engines of Vaul with a Wraithgate-carrying Storm Serpent to deploy them from, but that just adds another level of trickiness to the list for a new-player general.)
Last edited by The Other Dave on Mon Sep 03, 2012 12:07 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by The Other Dave » Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:26 am

Group 3: Challenging

Titan Legions
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➢ Two Warlord Titans
➢ Three Warhound Scout Titans
➢ Marauder Squadron: 2 Marauders

Ork Gargant Bigmob
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➢ Two Great Gargants
➢ A Reg’lar Gargant
➢ Two Loota Warbands, each with: 1 stand of Nobz, 6 stands of Boyz, 2 stands of Grotz, 3 Big Guns including a Supa-Zzap Gun, and a Flakwagon

I'll describe these together since they have similar strengths and weaknesses. Very very hard, very very shooty units, which are woefully outnumbered and outmaneuvered in a game that can punish both those things harshly. Your small number of formations means that you’re generally going to be reactive rather than proactive, and since many of your units are slow to boot you’re going to have trouble controlling the flow of the battle. You’ll also potentially have trouble projecting threat wherever you need it on the field. On the other hand, your formations are very very hard to kill and can vaporize most things they choose to shoot at or assault. Titans and Gargants are going to be very troublesome individually for pretty much any other army, but a canny opponent will be able to keep your army at arm’s length, dictate who you get to shoot at and whether you get to assault at all, and snatch up objectives from under your nose if you’re not careful. Still, a tricky army for an opponent to handle and undeniably a lot of fun.

Comparing the two, the Titan Legions sacrifice some durability for shootiness and speed (warhounds are very fast, but have trouble under heavy fire and fairly short-ranged weaponry), while Gargants are slower, with less-accurate shooting, but much much tougher – it takes a lot of work to take down a single Great Gargant, let alone two. Gargants are also very good in an assault – but on the other hand, they’re very slow and easy to avoid. The Orks also get a couple infantry formations for support / objective protection, although they have proportionately rather a lot of grotz and big gunz so don’t benefit from Ork morale rules as much as they could.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by me_in_japan » Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:46 am

Eh, can I call dibs on either the eldar or the nids, please? Either is fine, if someone else has a preference for one or t'other.

Ps very useful and informative post, Dave. Ta muchly :)
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by Tenorikuma » Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Well, now you have me tempted to try out Epic. Would the Imperial Guard be available?
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by Primarch » Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:00 am

I'm calling dibs on the Tyrants Legion/Astral Claws. Oh wait that's my army. :D
I am really looking forward to this, I hope you can get the room organised and that everyone can make it.
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by Spevna » Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:24 am

Can I grab the Knight Titans please?
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Re: Epicstravaganza Two: Thoughts on Forces, Calling Dibs, e

Post by Admiral-Badruck » Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:17 am

Orks with Fightabomas please.
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