Making the game your own.

[Primarch]

If you are comparing EVERY FoW list to one 40k codex, of course there will be more variety.

Still, to each their own and all that. I can agree to disagree.

As you have tried so many 40k armies before, what would you want to start?

[Colonel Voss]

I'm not. But given that the IG is from a million different worlds; feral, desert, jungle, hive and what not. And yet each squad has a veteran sgt. and they all have the same gear options and nothing the distinguish between them? Remember codex Catachan? Then look at the space marine choices, vanilla, blood, dark, black, evil, and hairy. There is a lacking in the current codex.

Remember I said I was uninspired reading the codex. The previous dex inspired me. This one is more apt to put me to sleep. It feels generic. I remember during the first apoc game you said how you just gave them grey armor because they were expendable (sorry can't remember the exact wording). I felt that was wrong, that the guard had the most color. Now, I feel like your grey painted guard and this codex go together.

[Primarch]

Remember I said I was uninspired reading the codex. The previous dex inspired me. This one is more apt to put me to sleep. It feels generic. I remember during the first apoc game you said how you just gave them grey armor because they were expendable (sorry can't remember the exact wording). I felt that was wrong, that the guard had the most color. Now, I feel like your grey painted guard and this codex go together.

My regulars were in grey and my veterans were in black so that people could distinguish them.

[Colonel Voss]

Ah, with John there you didn't bring them, no wonder they were all grey.

As for what army, I don't know really. Necrons maybe but my mind is so preoccupied with moving (next tuesday it starts) that I haven't put much thought into it.

But what this has done is made the thought of putting together three lists and painting said lists for Nagham a really tedious and unenjoyable prospect. It also makes me worried about what I did to Jus two years ago and being such a batch of sour grapes this year.

[Konrad]

Ah, with John there you didn't bring them, no wonder they were all grey.

As for what army, I don't know really. Necrons maybe but my mind is so preoccupied with moving (next tuesday it starts) that I haven't put much thought into it.

But what this has done is made the thought of putting together three lists and painting said lists for Nagham a really tedious and unenjoyable prospect. It also makes me worried about what I did to Jus two years ago and being such a batch of sour grapes this year.

Voss, you think too much. Relax buddy. I do hardly any thinking at all and look how happy I am.

[Colonel Voss]

Sorry, no off switch for my brain. It has one gear, warp 9.9 and it doesn't slow down no matter what I do. In fact, my insomnia medicine really does slow do my brains thinking abilities so I can actually get some sleep.

[Admiral-Badruck]

Ah, with John there you didn't bring them, no wonder they were all grey.

As for what army, I don't know really. Necrons maybe but my mind is so preoccupied with moving (next tuesday it starts) that I haven't put much thought into it.

But what this has done is made the thought of putting together three lists and painting said lists for Nagham a really tedious and unenjoyable prospect. It also makes me worried about what I did to Jus two years ago and being such a batch of sour grapes this year.

Voss, you think too much. Relax buddy. I do hardly any thinking at all and look how happy I am.

The greatest thing about being an ork. We do not think much.

[me_in_japan]

Voss, you think too much. Relax buddy. I do hardly any thinking at all and look how happy I am.

Posts like this remind me why I read this site

Back on topic, I think Voss's point about the IG codex is a pretty common one. We all have our pet armies, by which I mean the army we identify or engage with the most. After playing the game for a few years we form an impression of how that army should be, based on a combination of the rules we are used to, how the codex plays in the current rule set, and just our own mental image of what (for example) "The Imperial Guard" means. When that image doesn't match the game designer's own (and it almost never does - we're all unique, after all) we feel like something has been taken away from us. This usually manifests itself when a new codex comes out, but it can also happen when a new rules edition is released. I have it even worse than Voss - in my opinion the eldar rules have never represented eldar as I imagine them in my head. But then, if you go too far down that road you end up with movie marines. I think it's important to work with what you've been given by the designers, but also be able to say "I dislike this sufficiently that I don't want to use it". In that situation, just change the rules. Obviously you have to run it by your opponent, but the fundamental nature of 40k is that it is, when you get right down to it, just made up. Yeah, game designers get paid to make things up, but that doesn't make their opinions any more valid than your own.

[Danguinius]

I have two things to add to this discussion.

#1 I often wonder if 40K/Fantasy aren`t suffering a bit because of their origins as almost a RPG. This idea of creating your own character and equipping them how you want and then controlling their actions is very similar to most RPGs. I think this sort of customize-ability appeals to a lot of wargamers (who may actually be closeted RPGers). Indeed, when you ask a 40K/Fantasy player why they don`t like PP games or why they don`t want to try them, one of the most common reasons is the inability to design your own characters or eqip them (or choose their spell list, etc.). Some 40K releases in the past 6-7 years have really stream-lined the customize-ability (or removed it entirely), and I think this has bothered a lot of those closeted RPGers.

#2 Probably because I`m the oldest player on this forum, I tend to also view these changes to the game (adding options or streamlining or something else) as expected. Especially with 40K, the designers deliberately change the rules and how the army plays with the intent of making you stop using your favorite models/units (that were good) and buy new models/units (that are now good in the new codex). They have always done this. They will probably always do this. So, if you wargame for a long time, you just come to expect it. Thus, changes to an army`s "character" can be seen as temporary ( a few years) and will probably come back full circle if you hold on to your army long enough. If you really don`t like the "new" way your army plays, you can always make a new one (also their intention). But, it`s unrealistic to assume that the way your army plays now will continue for any great period of time.

I`m not trying to offend anyone. These are just my observations on how people react to changes in the way their armies play...especially 40K.

Danguinius

[Colonel Voss]

Boy, I don't even know where to begin.

When I say I am uninspired, I mean that in every possible meaning. Rule wise, 5th Ed rules plus the IG codex rules makes the guard boring. It doesn't play the way I feel the guard should be, but that is fine; I'm willing to suspend disbelief and go with the flow.

The way the book is written is plain and uninteresting. None of the fluff reaches out and grabs my attention. The special characters reinforce that especially when the rules collide with the background (Al'rahem and the Valhallan guy are both captains, not Lt.). This is painful but bearable as there are so many IG books written up.

The artwork is uninspiring. The main picture is just boring, endless Cadians surging forward in the same uniform. Again bearable as there is plenty of other artwork out there.

The miniature gallery and the miniatures themselves are uninspiring. I hate cadians and catachans, and the minimization of the other guard regiments and variety really makes looking through the pictures really boring. Boring, good thing the older dexes have better pictures.

The expansion that we got in 5th Ed codex was ho-hum. Sure there are some new infantry options and loads of new tanks and the birds. Then again, most of those options were in previous editions and many of the tanks were already made by forgeworld. And I have glued together enough leman russes and chimera hulls thank you very much. Again, not a killer but sad.

When you put all of that together, it is a killjoy for me. In the last codex, I had images of seven or eight different regiments that I could paint up including converting empire to IG (medieval infantry drafted and given lasguns) dancing through my head. Now, it doesn't really matter what my infantry look like as the key focus is on the tanks are there to support the armor. While I am a treadhead and I love the sight of a good armor formation, that isn't the be all and end all of the game for me. I understand what GW did with the guard, they are the mass formation with the most armor whereas the 'nids are mass formation with monsters and orks are mass formations with wacky gizmos.

We all have our pet armies, by which I mean the army we identify or engage with the most.

I think MiJ hit it on the nose. I don't identify or engage with the guard anymore. The past two years of my life have been trying and taxing on me. Last year was the year from Hell. I've changed a lot and I don't think I identify much with them anymore. What I identify with now, well I don't know.