Definitely NOT a Primarch

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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by Primarch » Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:18 am

Seb wrote:You don't have Leman Russ yet Prim?
I have the orgininal model from the 1980s, it's tiny.
Sadly, when Kabuki started releasing models (under a different name at the time), I didn't know about it. I missed getting my hands on Leman Russ and Mortarion.
You can buy it here for just 12000 yen. Personally I'll pass since I think that Kabuki will release a similar model again in the future to fill out their range. Maybe they wont, but I can always find someone to scratch build me one.
Colonel Voss wrote:Cool if you can order me Lorgar, I'll happily pay ya back.
It wont be for at least a month. They should still have some in stock though. I think it'll cost roughly 5000 yen depending on exchange rates etc.
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by Spevna » Wed Apr 27, 2011 1:54 pm

http://www.kabukimodels.com/index.php?g ... osci&id=24

Kabuki are doing a deal on their Knights of Legend.
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by AndrewGPaul » Sun May 08, 2011 10:09 pm

Don't like that at all.

I'm not enamoured of the current Heresy-era look in general, though. Far too much gothic-looking crap.

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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by me_in_japan » Mon May 09, 2011 11:28 am

eh? What? This is 40k we're talking about here. Gothic is where its at. :roll:
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by AndrewGPaul » Mon May 09, 2011 5:39 pm

Not during the Heresy, though. 40K is gothic and overblown because they've had 10 millennia of religious domination and scientific backsliding. During the Crusade, everything is supposed to be shiny and new and a glorious example of the Emperor's vision of a rational humanity where superstition is done away with. So apparently we have Leman Russ with bits of dead alsatian stapled to his armour and Magnus the Red done up like the waiters at the Las Vegas Luxor.

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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by Primarch » Mon May 09, 2011 10:54 pm

AndrewGPaul wrote:Not during the Heresy, though. 40K is gothic and overblown because they've had 10 millennia of religious domination and scientific backsliding. During the Crusade, everything is supposed to be shiny and new and a glorious example of the Emperor's vision of a rational humanity where superstition is done away with. So apparently we have Leman Russ with bits of dead alsatian stapled to his armour and Magnus the Red done up like the waiters at the Las Vegas Luxor.
Except that the Wolves, Sons and a few other founding legions (e.g. White Scars), still carried a lot of thier homeworld traditions over with them into the Legions, like wearing alsations. Legions like the Ultramarines, Fists and Luna Wolves were, as you say, rational and lacking in superstition.
As for the armour being gothic I like it, the old Mk III armour with its medieval like visor is certainly fairly gothic, in fact the primarch stuff actually looks a little more advanced. Certainly, compared to the current Mk VII armour on most of the marine kits now it looks more gothic, but I feel that adds some character, rather than taking something away.
Compare:
Old style
Image
Primarch style
Image
Current style
Image
The Primarch armour is clearly more ornate than the pre-heresy armour, though both fit the definition of gothic whilst the Mk VII actually looks more hi-tech with its smooth, rounded parts.
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by me_in_japan » Tue May 10, 2011 11:44 am

o wise prim, when was Mk VII first introduced, fluff-wise? I mean, which millenium? It was a while post-heresy, wasnt it?

also, has there ever been an official time period for mk VIII armour, or was it just a one-off that they nicked bits off for the grey knights and termis and whatnot?
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by Primarch » Tue May 10, 2011 12:04 pm

me_in_japan wrote:o wise prim, when was Mk VII first introduced, fluff-wise? I mean, which millenium? It was a while post-heresy, wasnt it?

also, has there ever been an official time period for mk VIII armour, or was it just a one-off that they nicked bits off for the grey knights and termis and whatnot?
The Mk VII was introduced at the end of the Heresy. You remember how in Mechanicum, Dorn sent a bunch of Imperial Fists to pick up all the spare armour? They also picked up the mechanicus adepts responsible for the new design and churned out a few suits before the battle of Terra. After the Heresy, all the chapters started being given Aquila armour.

Mk VIII is (circa 40,000) just being introduced to the Astartes and is very very rare. Most Forge Worlds and Marine Forges can't produce it in any volume yet.

All info comes from http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Power_Armour and http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Power_Armour
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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by AndrewGPaul » Tue May 10, 2011 12:39 pm

Dave, you're the man with a copy of the Warhammer 40,000 Compilation; look it up. :)

Mark 1 was pre-Crusade, marks 2, 3 and 4 were introduced during the Crusade, mark 5 appeared early in the Heresy, mark 6 appeared late on - after Horus' forces started assaulting the solar system (although there was somehow enough time for both sides to distribute it amongst their forces, galaxy-wide) - and mark 7 appeared among loyalist forces during the final seige of Earth.

No date has ever been given, IIRC, for mark 8 armour. Some time between the end of the Heresy and "now" is all you can say. That Lexicanum article is annoyingly poorly referenced, so there's no way of knowing where they got their info.

By the by, the canonical appearance of mark 8 armour has changed; according to Imperial Armour vol. 10, mark 8 armour uses the double-layered shoulder pads from the Company Champion marine in the command squad, and doesn't have the foprearm armour coming down over the back of the hands any more.

The mark 7 suit is just as much a result of Crusade-era development as the mark 2 (albeit with a couple of centuries of technological rediscovery and development), so I wouldn't draw any conclusions from that particular example - which is, after all, missing the usual purity seals, decorational skulls, devotional script, engraving, iconography, etc.

I'd agree that some egions were more ritualistic than others, if it wasn't for the fact that none of the Heresy-era artwork seems to reflect the difference in tone. None of the Horus Heresy novel covers would look out of place in the 41st millennium instead of the 31st. It just looks to me like the artists all missed the essential difference in tone between the settings.

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Re: Definitely NOT a Primarch

Post by Primarch » Tue May 10, 2011 12:56 pm

AndrewGPaul wrote:By the by, the canonical appearance of mark 8 armour has changed; according to Imperial Armour vol. 10, mark 8 armour uses the double-layered shoulder pads from the Company Champion marine in the command squad, and doesn't have the foprearm armour coming down over the back of the hands any more.
Comparing the model with IA 10, I think the Company Champion is supposed to be wearing full Mk8 armour. I have to admit, I do like the buffed up shoulder pads, shame they're so hard to get a hold of.
AndrewGPaul wrote:I'd agree that some legions were more ritualistic than others, if it wasn't for the fact that none of the Heresy-era artwork seems to reflect the difference in tone. None of the Horus Heresy novel covers would look out of place in the 41st millennium instead of the 31st. It just looks to me like the artists all missed the essential difference in tone between the settings.
I wonder if the artists got to read the books before they set about doing the artwork or whether they were just told "Do some marines in a big fight kinda thing" and only given current stuff to reference. The Horus Heresy Collected Visions book has some very nice artwork in it, so I wonder if any of them referenced that. The full sized cover for Deliverance Lost looked nice, and the cover for Prospero Burns certainly had a Shiny Clean future of the 31st millenium look about it except for the Space Wolves in the foreground.
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