Campaign Armies

[Primarch]

At the end of this year, the WFB campaign will be over and I will be launching a new 40K campaign in the new year.

As part of the new campaign, I want to encourage people to play more of the add-ons such as battle missions and spearhead AND try to get people to play fluffy armies. This will of course be voluntary, but there will be rewards for doing so.

To that end, I want people to put up their ideas of what would be some good choices for fluffy army lists.
For example:

Space Marine Battle Company.
1 captain
0-1 Librarian or Chaplain
Tactical Squads
Assault Squads
Devastator Squads
0-1 Whirlwind, Vindicator or Predator
0-1 Techmarine
0-1 Dreadnought
Command Squad
May not contain more razorbacks than Rhinos.

I'd like to see lists that are fairly restrictive in terms of bringing the best units from a book and that make sense from a fluff perspective.

Everything will be open to comment, but lets try and keep things constructive.

[me_in_japan]

Hum. As (probably) the prime offender when it comes to list tailoring, I have to say that fluffy armies are all well and good, but unfortunately from an eldar perspective, list tailoring is fluffy. I'm not trying to be a cheese-meister here, but the fluff says very clearly (and has done for many, many years) that the eldar way of war breaks down as follows:

1) avoid conflict wherever possible (unless your're Biel-Tan)
2) If the farseers see an unavoidable conflict coming, ask them exactly what it is they see, and go round up the appropriate aspect warriors to deal with it.
3) apply said aspect warriors to the applicable weak points in the opposing army.
4) go home and write a poem about it.

This is a big reason why I enjoy playing eldar. I've never made a secret of the fact that I consider army building to be a major part of the fun of 40k. With certain armies (fragile ones in general, and eldar particularly) games are largely won or lost on list building. To give up on list building is to give up on a big part of the appeal of the game.

I'm really keen to be involved in this kind of campaign game, I'm just not sure that nixing the list building stage of the game is a good way to go about it. I'm open to suggestions or negotiation here - as I said, I am keen to get involved, just not sure how to go about it.

[Primarch]

...
2) If the farseers see an unavoidable conflict coming, ask them exactly what it is they see, and go round up the appropriate aspect warriors to deal with it.
...

So assuming they faced identical threats, Biel-Tan, Iyanden, Siam-Hann and Ulthwe would all send identical forces?
Likewise a Goff ork army has the same general make-up as Evil Sunz or Deathskulls?

Try to think of it as a challenge to try something new. Not everyone has the amount of models that you or I do and in some cases cannot tailor their lists at all. So instead of saying to them "Buy more models" I'm saying to those of us who can look at what we're likely to face and bring the appropriate counters to perhaps limit themselves somewhat and do so in a manner which emphasises the stories we read about the game rather than the easiest way to win.

[me_in_japan]

I appreciate that, and I'm really (really really) not trying to be arsey about this, I just dont know how to limit an eldar army without gimping it completely. I do try and vary my army every time I play. Yes, I almost always use aspect warriors, but complaining that an eldar army has aspect warriors is like complaining that an ultramarines army has space marines in it.

How would you, as a blanket rule, limit an eldar army's choice of units? (serious question)

*edit* if it would make life less complicated, I could just play dark eldar, or nurgle...

*2nd edit* just a thought: how about if players publicly show their army lists before the game, and offer the opponent a chance to either upgrade or downgrade their units (in terms of thwap, rather than points) until both players are happy the lists are balanced? Like you would for a historical game. (or so I'd imagine)

[Primarch]

2 options off the top of my head.
1. A no aspect warriors list. You'd still get Harlies for Assaulting stuff and you'd be able to take lots of firepower in the form of tanks and walkers etc.
2. An aspect warriors only list (transports would be ok). Maybe throw the Avatar in there as well.

And before you start yelling, look at the marine list I suggested. No Sternguard, TH/SS Termies or Land Raiders and a limit on razorbacks, all the things you'd expect to see in a game winning army.

[Colonel Voss]

Demons are easy, one god armies or pair only.

Imperial guard;

Light infantry (catachan)
no commissars
HQ: Company command
Elite: ratlings
Troops: platoons, veterans
Fast Attacks: sentinels, fast attack tanks
Heavy support: 1 leman russ
no mechanization

Line breaker regiment (Catachan)
HQ: Company command with artillerist, commissar lord
elite: ogryns, may be put in a chimera
Troops: Infantry platoons, may choose either one penal legion squad or veteran with carapace armor
Fast Attack: Armored Sentinels, 1 fast attack tank
Heavy support: up to three leman russes, 1 artillery tank

Eldar:

Rapid strike force: Sometimes the Eldar due to unforseen events or a mistake of some sort or limited numbers, the Eldar need to react with a fast force consisting of what is avaliable.

HQ: Autarch
Troops: Jet bike Eldar, rangers
May only take three aspect warrior squads but they must be in wave serpents.
Fire Prisms and Falcons

Defensive formation: While the Eldar do not like to hold static positions, sometimes this is necessary while the enemy is flanked or out maneuvered elsewhere. In this case, strategic forces are relocated elsewhere and the line is held by what is avaliable usually reinforced with strong components.

HQ: Avatar, farseer, autarch
Elite: striking scorpions, fire dragons, wraithguard
Troops: 1+ guardian defender squad, dire avengers, rangers
Fast Attack: Warp Spiders
Heavy Support: Support Weapon battery, Dark reapers, wraithlord, war walker, 1 Falcon or fire prism
no transports

Space wolf blood claw force: Sometimes after a large war, a huge influx of new blood claws need to be blooded

HQ: 1+ Wolf Priest, wolf guard battle leader
Elite: Dreadnought, Iron priest, wolf scout
Troops: 1+ blood claw pack (1 must be of 15), 0-1 grey hunter pack
Fast attack: swift claw biker pack, skyclaw assault pack
Heavy support: predator

Minotaurs (blood angel codex): as a space based and close combat force, the minotaurs are known for their violence and up close and personal attack abilities

HQ: Captain, reclusiarch
Elite: chaplain, terminator squad, terminator assault squad, venerable dreadnought
Troops: 2+ assault squads, death company, scout squad, tactical squad
Fast Attacks: vanguard veteran, land speeder, attack bike, bike, scout bike
Heavy Support: dreadnought
transports: land raider crusader or redeemer, rhino, drop pod

[Primarch]

Hmm.
The catachan light infantry look the business and the wolves look like Ragnars company.
The Eldar seem very much based on a tactical situation rather than representing the army as portrayed in the codex. The minotaurs/blood angels....I'm not sure.

[Colonel Voss]

cut over half of the army list out to make the minotaurs. it was always a bit hard to sit there and so ooohhhh that would be so good, but doesn't fit the theme.

The line breaker regiment is how I build my Kahayans and it's nowhere near as harsh as the leaf blower lists.

Eldar, well the other craftworlds had their own codex for a long time, might be good to find that and see how it would fit with the new lists

[Admiral-Badruck]

Admiral Badruck and Da flash gitz! Free booter bands.

HQ. A warboss in mega armor
With all the flash one can put on him.

Orks have great Heavy support Flash gitz are not good at all compared to killerkanz, battle wagons.

Taking flash gitz at all is a huge point sink.


Every unit mounted in a truck or battle wagon on a bike or in a buggy or deffkoptaz

No grotz other than ammo runtz.

Every Ork must look like feerbooter.

[Primarch]

Admiral Badruck and Da flash gitz! Free booter bands.

HQ. A warboss in mega armor
With all the flash one can put on him.

Orks have great Heavy support Flash gitz are not good at all compared to killerkanz, battle wagons.

Taking flash gitz at all is a huge point sink.

Every unit mounted in a truck or battle wagon on a bike or in a buggy or a deaf deffkoptaz

No grotz other than ammo runtz.

Every Ork must look like feerbooter.

I think modelling requirements may be a little extreme.
A freebooterz list is a good idea though. I'll see if I have a copy of the old ork books.....