Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

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jus
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Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by jus » Wed Aug 25, 2021 12:37 pm

Let's talk about 40k lore! There have been a number of bomb shell revelations since GW has decided to push forward with the 40k narrative, from the Horus Heresy to the the more recent 40k novels.

So who was the first primarch found? According to the recount of the Alpharius in his Primarch series novel, it was Alpharius himself whose gestation pod only never left Terra and crashed on the other side of the planet! He is then discovered, then raised by the Emperor and Malcador and was present at the reunions of most of his brother primarchs! (all in the guise of ordinary legionaries!)

hmm truth or deception.

In any case an Mind blowing...and an excellent read.

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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Primarch » Wed Aug 25, 2021 10:08 pm

Well, I haven't read the Alpharius book yet, but I will try and do so sooner rather than later if it is that good.

Obviously, anything told from the Alpha Legion's point of view needs to be taken with a power fist sized pinch of salt. They are hardly known for their honesty and transparency.

A lot depends on which Alpharius is telling the story. The timing is also an issue. Is it set before or after the events in Praetorian of Dorn? Speaking of, have you read that? It's a good book about how the Alpha Legion operates, though mainly told from the Imperial Fist's point of view. Spoiler alert, they have a very dim view of their cousins in the XXth Legion. It also has some pretty important consequences for the Alpha Legion.


Personally I'm currently reading through Corax (Book 40 in The Horus Heresy, rather than the Primarchs series book with the same title). Though not as focused on subversion and forming cells of operatives, it would appear that the Raven Guard are more than capable of using similar tactics to the Alpha Legion when it suits them.
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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Mattb » Wed Aug 25, 2021 11:48 pm

Unfortunately I'm not too up to date with a lot of the new stuff. I really want to get through the heresy series, but 50 books is a daunting mountain to start climbing - especially since I usually don't find Space Marine stuff that interesting. Is it possible to just go straight to the Siege of Terra stuff without reading all the other books?

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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Primarch » Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:26 am

Mattb wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 11:48 pm
Unfortunately I'm not too up to date with a lot of the new stuff. I really want to get through the heresy series, but 50 books is a daunting mountain to start climbing - especially since I usually don't find Space Marine stuff that interesting. Is it possible to just go straight to the Siege of Terra stuff without reading all the other books?
I'm only up to book 40 in the series, so I'm not 100% sure, but I can't see why you couldn't just pick up the series from the start of the Siege of Terra.
It would be rather like watching the last movie in a trilogy without watching the others first though. There are bound to be characters and sub-plots that are carried through from the main series. Some of which is established lore that you may already be aware of though, so your mileage may vary.
Due to its sheer size and scope, the HH series runs from being absolutely outstanding to a dull crawl through pages of monotony. A lot of it is down to the writers and the style of storytelling you prefer. If you don't enjoy reading about Space Marines, maybe the HH books aren't going to appeal that much, since the whole focus of the stories is on the marines and the Primarchs with very few exceptions.
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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by The Other Dave » Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:01 am

Primarch wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 12:26 am
If you don't enjoy reading about Space Marines, maybe the HH books aren't going to appeal that much, since the whole focus of the stories is on the marines and the Primarchs with very few exceptions.
Heck, even Titandeath (the only HH book I’ve read so far, because... well, Titans) had to wedge in some scenes of primarchs moping and a gratuitous scene of Sanguinius soloing an Imperator.
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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by jus » Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:36 am

The Horus Heresy series has been a masterwork of literature. It has been an incredible journey, with some epic moments. There are only 2 of the 53 odd books that I'd say were not great.

I'd say start from book one: Horus Rising and experience the the heresy the way it was meant to be. As prim said, I've been there since day one and there are still characters and plot points that I should know but either can't remember properly or have never heard of. But that's OK, think of it as a grand account of historical fiction, there may be areas that are fuzzy, but then digging up the details is half the fun (for me anyway)
even Titandeath (the only HH book I’ve read so far, because... well, Titans) had to wedge in some scenes of primarchs moping and a gratuitous scene of Sanguinius
AND THEY WERE AWESOME! He knew he wasn't going to die that day because of visions of his fate decided. So I think he was testing his fate to see if he could actually survive against an imperator. That and he can fly...and jink and dodge and has the spear of Telesto. I guess the Ad Mech didn't think about flying primarchs when they drew up the blue prints for imperators.

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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Mattb » Thu Aug 26, 2021 6:46 am

Fair enough. I think if I just power on through them they'll sink the hooks in and I'll eventually get through all of them - either that or jusr read the ones that focus on the things I'm interested in (like the Emperor's Children or Dark Angels) and hope it's enough to read the newer books. :lol:

As for other Black Library books, I just finished reading Gunheads and thought it was really good. Especially if you like tanks.

A part from that, I highly recommend the Vaults of Terra series. They're probably the best BL books I've read. That and the Watchers of the Throne series made Chris Wraight my favorite author, I think.

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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by The Other Dave » Thu Aug 26, 2021 9:51 am

jus wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:36 am
AND THEY WERE AWESOME! He knew he wasn't going to die that day because of visions of his fate decided. So I think he was testing his fate to see if he could actually survive against an imperator. That and he can fly...and jink and dodge and has the spear of Telesto. I guess the Ad Mech didn't think about flying primarchs when they drew up the blue prints for imperators.
Ha ha yeah, it’s just that the rest of the book was a very human-level drama about sweaty, grimy humans in their cramped, oily, uncomfortable Titans and living quarters on an extended campaign and how it ground them down and how they dealt with that, then suddenly golden demigod action scene! and then back to grime and sweat. I loved the human-level stuff though, it really informed how I think about the Titans and crew in my little battlegroup for AT.

On the general thread topic though, I haven’t read a whole lot of BL stuff - the Eisenhorn trilogy and some old books like Drachenfels or Plague Daemon in the 90s. I have a good backlog of stuff to listen to on the BL audio app, since they offer sales from time to time, but I’m basically stingy when it comes to buying anything but food or models so 3000 yen for a book or audiobook is a big ask. :D
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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Karantu » Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:05 am

Woops, I'm a little late to the party.
Being a massive Alpha Legion fan I absolutely loved Head of the Hydra, all the way from the start with Alpharious being the first Primarch discovered (pretty much not even lost) and all the way to the end with Horus thinking he found Alpharious the entire book basically throws all the established lore out the window and one ups everyone else. Given that it is from the mouth of the Hydra speculating about how much of it actually true is also probably part of the experience. Alpharious' interactions with all the other major characters, such as the Lion, where he's constantly playing mind games is extremely on-brand and I'll never get sick of them pulling the classic "I am Alpharious". It left me feeling like I had to fill in the rest of the gaps by reading more about the rest of the Alpha Legion's misadventures.

Image

I also need to get through the rest of this pile of books. I'm currently half way through The First Wall and the only thing holding me back is the form factor since I've also been reading more ebooks (that I got on one of those amazing Humble Bundles) during the free time I have while I'm out.

Anyway it sounds like I need to add Titandeath and Gunheads to the list though since I enjoyed the few Mechanicus novels I've read so far.

P.S. BL doesn't translate the same way in my head...

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Re: Black Library Lore discussion (Spoilers!)

Post by Jye Nicolson » Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:08 am

Karantu wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 11:05 am
P.S. BL doesn't translate the same way in my head...
Yeah I always do a double take when I see Warhammer fans referring to Black Library that way.

I assume it is part of the fandom but not in the same ratio as the normal use of that acronym.

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