40K 10th Ed. Discussion Thread

[Primarch]

It looks like HH minis will be getting an index entry and then left to gather dust for the rest of the edition.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/202 ... mer-40000/
No word on how they will treat the rest of the old FW/Imperial Armour ranges, but I'd expect all the resin kits to be dealt with in a similar manner.

And while each army will get one set of rules at launch, marines will have access to six sets, as the rules for Space Wolves, Blood & Dark Angels, Templars and Deathwatch are no longer locked behind aesthetic choices. My own feelings about aesthetics being important to your army's narrative aside, this does seem a little unfair to every non-marine army/player.

[Jye Nicolson]

Technically Marine rules haven't been locked behind aesthetics for a long time, since nothing was stopping you from using a successor chapter as whatever. And technically nothing was stopping you from taking your Thunderwolf Cavalry and Wulfen out of your Wolves list and saying they were Ultramarines instead, other than people thinking that's weird in a way they wouldn't if you did the same thing with Hive Fleets

The real change is it's no longer a bad idea to paint your Marines in a canon colour scheme.

It is going to give Marines more options than everyone else to begin with and probably forever, which is an advantage but we'll have to see how strong an advantage it is for casual play. Detachments are still swap in swap out so it's no longer "everything in the Codex plus everything in the Codex Supplement on top".

[Primarch]

Technically Marine rules haven't been locked behind aesthetics for a long time, since nothing was stopping you from using a successor chapter as whatever. And technically nothing was stopping you from taking your Thunderwolf Cavalry and Wulfen out of your Wolves list and saying they were Ultramarines instead, other than people thinking that's weird in a way they wouldn't if you did the same thing with Hive Fleets

I think part of that is that the non-codex compliant marines have often been presented as separate entities (Codex Space Wolves was released way back in 2nd ed, 30 years ago), whereas Nids have largely been confined to one book. Even a relatively new player will be able to differentiate between Ultramarines and Space Wolves, whereas a large percentage of the player base won't really be able to identify all of the main hive fleets based on colour schemes.

Nothing (aside from disapproving stares and minor grumbling) has ever officially stopped a player from using chapter A marines with chapter B rules. It is a personal choice that comes down to how you value the lore vs. rules. It is similar in a way to sports. Do you support your favourite team no matter how poor their line-up is this year, or do you just follow the strongest team in the league? Of course, it would help if GW could write fairly balanced rules and avoid having one sub-faction/chapter that was clearly better than all of the others.

Honestly, if you think about it, the only difference between any models is aesthetic in nature. A marine, a gaunt and a guardian are all just the same bits of plastic, just with different shapes. Most people seem to draw a line somewhere before reaching the "These gretchin are dreadnoughts" level of proxying at least.

Ah well, c'est la vie, models are too expensive to easily replsce and sometimes their rules are unfortunately disappointing. Having fun playing the game is the most important thing after all, so just ignore the grumbling old curmudgeons (like me).

[Jye Nicolson]

I think part of that is that the non-codex compliant marines have often been presented as separate entities (Codex Space Wolves was released way back in 2nd ed, 30 years ago), whereas Nids have largely been confined to one book. Even a relatively new player will be able to differentiate between Ultramarines and Space Wolves, whereas a large percentage of the player base won't really be able to identify all of the main hive fleets based on colour schemes.

I got that codex when it was new! I blame it for all those Wolves on my shelves now

That is the thing, of course, the Marines have always had the strongest identity and the only one that literally every 40k fan recognises. There are definitely folks who feel the same way about running Biel-Tan as Ulthwe as running Salamanders as Iron Hands but not nearly as many

But it does mean the Marine player gets into a weird dynamic when they glue on their first shoulder pad or put down their first brushstroke - unless they ignore those well established identities and picked their own colours, in which case they're fine. I think if we can just say "Space Wolves know how to fight Gladius style and can do so if necessary" the weird incentives/newbie traps largely go away and that's a good thing.

Do you support your favourite team no matter how poor their line-up is this year, or do you just follow the strongest team in the league? Of course, it would help if GW could write fairly balanced rules and avoid having one sub-faction/chapter that was clearly better than all of the others.

I do kind of wish I could just design my own purple uniform and have it count as Yomiuri, Yakult, DeNA or even Orix as the mood suited me though (not Hanshin, never Hanshin).

Fingers crossed 10th launches and stays as balanced as it looks like it will. Agreed six detachments is obviously better than one but hopefully that's a small enough advantage that it gets lost in the noise at our level of play.

[me_in_japan]

I have a question. I don't really have the time (or the inclination, tbh) to keep up with all the previews and hype building that's going on prior to 10th ed. From what folks have seen so far, what's the likelihood of me (or any new player, for that matter) being able to just pick up a copy of the rulebook and play a game (correctly) that same day? I can see we're onto page 9 of preview rules discussion, and that's...kinda off putting, even before the edition hits the shelves. I mean, is it looking like there'll be a ton of special rules for each army/unit XYZ, or are things mostly being differentiated by basic stats, while retaining the same gameplay mechanics across mostly everything?


oh, and fwiw, as a lifelong non-marine player, I can inform you marinees that there was only ever one kind of space marine. T4, 3+Sv, dies to plasma. All the other flimflammery is largely irrelevant.*


*yes, yes, there are and always were outlier variations (terminators, etc) but yer basic line marine/devastator/blood assault death claw company dudes were all much of a muchness. At least from where the pointy ears were standing, anyway

[Primarch]

The same day? Depends on how fast you read I guess. The rules seem fairly straightforward, but armies have had some major shake-ups.

In fact, you can download the rules for free from GW now. https://www.warhammer-community.com/202 ... ight-here/
The armies are being staggered across the next two weeks, but their cards and rules are coming.

The 9 pages of chat are due to GW's constant drip feeding of previews rather than any in-depth discussion about any major points.

If you want to get a better idea of what your army will look like, check out the Eldar preview if you haven't already. https://www.warhammer-community.com/202 ... s-aeldari/

Essentially every unit looks like it is getting some special rules as well as their army rules, but with the exception of USR's and common weapon types, everything should be on the unit's card.

[Jye Nicolson]

If you're able to play Combat Patrol I'd say same day for sure (though given the Combat Patrol rules seem like they're going to drop on the 20th, you can cheat and read the core rules Prim linked now).

I don't think an Incursion game would be much worse but you'd have to care about unit selection etc rather than just using the pre-built force. So I'd recommend waiting for Combat Patrol if you want to go easy on the brain meats while learning the *game*.

It's not too different from 9th, which you've played, so shouldn't be too rough. It's mostly your army rules are much friendlier.

[Jye Nicolson]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp- ... JIHqzx.pdf

These "quick start" rules look like a pretty solid cheatsheet too.

[Primarch]

One small point to mention, playing Combat Patrol requires you to have the specific models in your army's Combat Patrol box.

[Jye Nicolson]

One small point to mention, playing Combat Patrol requires you to have the specific models in your army's Combat Patrol box.

Yup, the mode will *only* support the exact fixed forces corresponding with one of those boxes (plus some extras like Leviathan, maybe some more as time goes on).

The flip side of that is I think it makes proxying easier than ever because there's no ambiguity as to what the models could be. Right size base and vaguely right size model and it should make zero difference.