Flames of War turn time question.

[ashmie]

One question which a mate of mine raised today that's often overlooked in the fluff and background of most modern wargames, but quite often highlighted in RPG rule books is 'How long does a turn represent IN REAL TIME?'
So basically how much real time does one game turn represent?
We couldn't find anything in the rules so we settled for one game turn representing one hour of real time. What are you thoughts on this, specifically in terms of Flames of War? |In FoW you can decide what time of day you are playing at but not how much time is passing.
Feel free to discuss other systems.

[ashmie]

Question 2.

The rules of FoW state that a platoon can split it's teams fire onto different targets but when it's a platoon of tanks they have to focus all their guns on the same target. Are we reading this right?

[job]

Wow, FoW. I haven't played this game for awhile, but it remains my favorite.

1) As for this question, it is interesting you ask now. a similar question came up on the Warlord forum for BLack Powder. In my opinion it is good to think of the turns in a bit of an elastic and abstract sense. A turn probably consists of various actions across several areas with different actors, but with common direction in the form of the commander-player's vision. War games and games in general I think so capture the nature of any competition or conflict. Commanders make decisions which play out on the table, and then their counterparts react or make independent plans depending on the circumstances and what they perceive as their opponents intentions. So, I've always felt in one part of a battlefield, a dash across a street with a platoon into the teeth of an enemy position maybe an action that takes seconds to a couple of minutes, while an observer coordinates with fire support to zero-in on a target more carefully over a few minutes while separate to these actions a tank team and a recon section work together to root out an enemy AT gun or tank team in ambush. This might go on for awhile. There might an intense burst of fighting at one point and a lull later as platoons regroup.

I think this fits in with the game designer's guiding philosophy. You can both listen to some of his thoughts on the game design on YouTube and find anecdotes within the fluff of the rulebook. Distances and the position of actual teams are two places that Phil explicitly states he would like players to keep the abstraction in mind. A infantry team may spread out. Tanks and artillery are actually firing over much longer distances. Terrain, too, is a bit abstract. An open field actually contains dips and brush infantry can hide in. Or infantry staying still will begin to fortify and dig into a position. (Again, time becomes a bit abstract as infantry can't really dig foxholes within seconds or just a handful of minutes.) Finally, actual battles took on very different natures. Some could be intense and brief, while others dragged on and become protracted affairs. And if you asked individuals who did participate in actual battles, time flowed often very differently and subjectively to the separate participants. (Keene notes something similar in Face of Battle.)

So in so many words I want to say, I wouldn't hold fast to any fixed time frame. Let your imagination fill the gaps in the time frame and add the details to the flow of action.

[job]

2) As for this question, it has been awhile so I have to brush up on my rules.

Remember teams and platoons are two different categories. Individiual teams in a platoon can nominate different platoons as targets.

Any team can nominate the type of target (infantry, transport, tank or gun team). These teams are the priority for the hits from this type of weapon. Nominate your priority before rolling to hit.

Remember to use allocate hits accordingly: (p.93)

1. Visible and in range teams only.
2. Evenly as possible
3. Not Gone To Ground first
4. Operational teams first (Teams not Bogged Down/Bailed out)
5. Within 16" before over 16"

As for tank teams:
P.111 - Tanks (and any team with mutiple weapons) can nominate different types of targets for their different weapons. This means you can target different platoons with the main gun and the machine guns. You can also nominate different types of targets, too ((infantry, transport, tank or gun team).

I hope that helps. Maybe it is more detail than you need. My apologies if I retreaded stuff you already know, but I was going back through the rules myself.

FoW can at first be a bit detaile and even daunting, but I think you'll find after a few games the rules become very easy to follow. It is very rational and carefully laid out, the most air tight set of rules I know of and experienced (mostly due to the designers approach and the close communication with the players), and it is all pretty much contained within the one rulebook. A few things are in an errata which is kept up to date. Finally, there is a great community on the FoW forum that can respond to any rules questions. There's even a newbie section. If there's really something that seems to be at the crux of things, Phil is known to reply and give a ruling. (My friend once posted something that came up in our game that Phil replied to and became part of the current edition.)

Anyway, enjoy the next game!

[ashmie]

Thanks for your extensive and thought provoking answers Job. We had fun playing the game and thinking about these things mid game and afterwards. We were a bit confused about the rule that says a tank must fire all it's weapons at the same target. This makes sense now thinking about platoons and teams. Each tank is a team essentially.
FoW really is a hidden gem in the war games world imho. Surpassed by the glories of Bolt Action, it still is a fantastic and simplistic system in it's own right.
Another game booked In January so expect lots more anti social 15mm postings from me soon