Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

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Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Sat May 23, 2020 9:32 am

So given that I like to complain about Games Workshop and other manufacturers all the time, I decided to make my own wargame.
I uploaded a post on my blog (which has a total of 3 posts now) in Japanese earlier today so I'm going to basically just post the same thing in English here.

Background:
Before I introduce the game, it helps to understand why I decided to make this game. It basically boils down to, wanting a game that's accessible to "plamodel" fans in Japan and thus utilizing the extensive variety of relatively cheap models available here and making that leap from collecting Gundam models to playing miniature wargames a bit easier. One other reason I decided to make this game is that I like complex game systems and enjoy the granularity they provide. As you can probably tell, making a non-miniature wargamer friendly game that is also complex is about as impossibly silly as it sounds so I've had to make some compromises but I think I've come up with a relatively unique and playable game system.
My main inspirations for the game were wargames like Battletech and Adeptus Titanicus as well as video games like XCOM.

Another decision I had to make was what sort of setting I wanted for the game and what the models were going to be.
Going 100% off of my personal preferences, I decided to focus on mech combat between squads of mass production mechs.
In other words, a good old slug-fest between the grunts that get killed in 1 shot in shows like Gundam.
Thus one of the first models I wrote rules for was the Zaku II.

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To pick another faction that was slightly different but not too different, I picked the 30MM line from Bandai.
They have some pretty decent looking mechs with a ton of customization, which I think is extremely important for a good miniatures game.

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Things needed to play the game:
Here's a list of the essentials to play this game.
・The models (In this demo I'm using a 30MM Alto and a Zaku II)
・Dice(d6s, d10s, d20s)
・A measuring tape (This game uses cm right now so I'm hoping that's a plus in Japan.)
・Playing cards (You'll see)
・An appropriate surface(This demo is played on a 110cm by 85cm area)
・Terrain
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Turn 1:
Before rolling for initiative both players decide what they want their mechs to do and place cards face down next to each mech to indicate what it's going to do. Next, both players roll for initiate and starting with the first player, both players take turns revealing one card at a time and activating the corresponding mechs.

In this demo, The Zaku player rolled higher so they go first.
The card they had placed was a 3, which is the Boost movement ability.
This allows the Zaku to move up to 42cm while ignoring any elevation changes due to terrain.
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This uses the 4 of the Zaku's 6 AP(Action Points).
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Next the Alto activates and moves using the Run action.
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This uses 2 of the Alto's 5 AP.
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Even though both players have activated all their mechs, since there are still mechs with AP remaining, both players place cards and activate their mechs again. The Zaku gets initiative but it had played a pass card so it does nothing.
The Alto uses 1/3 of its remaining AP to shoot using its SMG.
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This time, the Zaku is out of AP but the Alto still has 2 AP left so it uses this to shoot at the Zaku again. Unfortunately this time it misses.
Since there are no longer any mechs remaining that could act, the game moves to the next turn.[

Turn 2:
All cards in play are returned to the players' hands and the players place cards and roll for initiative again.
The Zaku player wins initiative and attempts to charge the Alto. However, the Alto player had placed the card for Overwatch, which allows him to interrupt an enemy during its movement and shoot at it with it's SMG. However, overwatch rolls are rolled with 2d10 taking the lowest and the Alto rolls a 1 and 2, missing the Zaku. The Zaku then continues its charge move and attacks with its Heak Hawk (the axe).
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The Heat Hawk connects and deals enough damage to destroy the Alto's left arm.
https://karakenhome.files.wordpress.com ... jpg?w=1024

Having lost it's melee weapon, the Alto decides to use SMG Strafe, which allows it to move and shoot. It manages to hit and deal 12 damage to the Zaku's legs but the Zaku ends up with 4HP remaining on its legs.
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Turn 3:
The Zaku wins the next initiative roll off and manages shoots the Alto right in the torso, dealing 18 damage which is enough to take it out.
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So that was a basic run through of how the game works right now. Its still very much a WIP but feel free to leave any feedback.
I'm probably going to work on expanding the range of units and weapons next, as well as working on the game balance.

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Primarch » Sat May 23, 2020 10:45 am

My first impression? It seems like a great idea.
I'd recommend printing your own cards (maybe glue them to the face of the playing cards). Have each card have all of the rules on it. Depending on the effort you want to make, have unique card sets for each mech. While it didn't come up because the Zaku dealt terminal damage in round 2, maybe have a cooldown feature for some of the abilities? E.g. some cards aren't returned to your hand after use, you have to wait X turns first.

My other thought was that you currently have the SMG rules as: Roll 1 die to hit, roll X dice for damage, with a decrease in damage based on range, which makes it very much an all or nothing attack. I'd suggest making it X dice to hit, with 1 die for each hit, with a to hit penalty at longer ranges. The first method seems better for a shotgun type weapon where the gun shoots once and shells spread out the further they travel.

Damage + Penetration Vs Armour seems simpler than Armour - Penetration > Net Armour - Damage. It's effectively the exact same thing, but would simplify the mental calculations.

And just as a general guideline for rules writing, (since you haven't shown other parts) keep the rules as consistent as possible.

For example:
In situation 1, roll A, B, then do C.
In situation 2, roll X, then do Y, roll Z.

Requires a lot more effort on the part of the players.

Whereas:
In situation 1, roll A, B, then do C.
In situation 2, roll A, B, then do C.

Will be much easier for everyone to follow.

#edit#
Second impression, the cards should have an initiative value on them, the die roll at the top of the turn should just be the tie breaker. E.g. Snap shots should have a high initiative, aimed shots a low initiative.
With the current rules, the player going first has all the power to dictate the game. If A is going first and thinks B has a "shoot" or "charge" card put down, they can simply scoot behind cover, thereby wasting B's action. Giving B the option of firing a potentially inaccurate burst before A hides would generate more choices in the game. It would also make the cards played more decisive.
Going back to the idea of unique card sets per mech, different chassis could offer different benefits, such as higher/lower initiatives, more/less efficient actions and so forth.
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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Sat May 23, 2020 3:26 pm

Primarch wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 10:45 am
Thanks for the feedback, I'll try and answer everything and explain my decisions on the rest.

I am experimenting with both custom cards and the playing card system and I think they both have their pros and cons.
My test plays with custom cards were a bit more fiddly than having numbered generic cards and referring to a table to see what they do.
I might still go back to custom cards since it works better for customizing units and reduces the clutter of a having one huge table on the data sheet.
I'm going to use a keyword system like MTG instead of writing all the rules on every single card/datasheet though.

Cooldowns, charge-ups, and limited ammo are all things I'm thinking of adding for sure.

Weapon balance is currently pretty rudimentary but I'm trying to make sure that small arms fire is less effective at long range but I agree that the current implementation seems more like a shotgun. I'm going to rework that probably. The fast rate of fire should be indicated by having a low AP cost and being able to be used multiple times per turn but I'll think about rolling to hit multiple times per attack to further emphasize that.

The reason for the Net ARM = ARM - PEN → damage dealt = Weapon Damage - Net ARM is to simulate over penetration while making low PEN weapons ineffective against armoured targets. In the demo game, the only reason the first salvo was completely ineffective was because the Zaku used it shield, but if it was focused fired on, it would take damage for sure. That being said the ARM and PEN values still need balancing for sure.

I'm going to have to be careful with the rules writing though since I'm simultaneously writing it in both English and Japanese while translating back and forth so thanks for the advice. I'll try and make a logic formula and stick to it.

Initiative needs to be a thing for sure. I'm trying not too add too many parameters to manage while still having the important ones in but I don't think I can compromise on initiative. The melee ZoC rules currently don't work if you're out of AP so I'm going to have to think of what to do with that too. Maybe have AP be more active abilities and have zero cost reactions for those situations or when your planned card becomes obsolete (default actions maybe).

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Primarch » Sun Nov 29, 2020 6:19 am

I saw this online and thought it may be of interest as it seems to cover the same ground.
https://www.wargamevault.com/m/product/334624
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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Sun Nov 29, 2020 6:52 am

Thanks. It is a similar concept in terms of the target model range and game scale. I might have to pick it up for reference.

I really need to get off my ass and actually put in some work into making it playable.
I already have everything I need to do figured out. Its just some busy work that I'm procrastinating on honestly.

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:02 am

I ended up releasing version 0.3.0 of Annihilation Zone to the public so if anyone is interested go ahead and check it out. I'll post more about it later but I do also want to see if it's playable with just the rules I've written.

Currently I've written rules for 4 different models from the 30MM line.
The units and their corresponding models are:
Squire - Alto
Siegemaster - Alto(Ground Type)
Drudge - Portanova
Veloprime - Portanova(Space Type)

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Primarch » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:27 am

Just had a quick read over the rules and had a few questions.

-What is the purpose of the Armour Layer Width?

-It seems to me like you have the basic ARM value, divided by Layer Width to calculate the effective ARM per attack. That is then compared to the PEN value of the gun. If PEN ≧ e.ARM, the inner structure takes damage. If the PEN < e.ARM, the inner structure takes no damage. In both cases, the location's ARM value is reduced, either by PEN or PEN + 1/2 Damage. In which case, is it the basic ARM or the effective ARM.

- What happens when PEN + 1/2 Damage > ARM remaining? Is the excess carried through, or lost?

-What happens if your legs are shot off?

-On the leg damage card, it says '+1AP cost'. I'm assuming that is for movement purposes only?

-What happens when two (or more) shots from the same gun strike the same location. Is ARM reduced after the first shot, or are they resolved against the same value?

I also had some thoughts on the rules so far. You may already have considered these points, or you may disagree with them entirely, it's your system after all.

The rules themselves look like a reasonable way of moving models around a table and having them blast chunks off each other. They do seem pretty math intensive though, requiring a fair bit of arithmetic as you go. While I can't speak for everyone, my first impression was that you should do more to reduce that. For example, the ARM calculations could be solved by having a damage track.
E.g. Arm 12/4 becomes
12.11.10.09.08.07.06.05.04.03.02.01 - Armour
03.03.03.03.02.02.02.02.01.01.01.01 - ARM
Same effect, easier to track and no mental calculations needed.

The chart for multiple hits seems to offer a penalty for a player who is lucky to land multiple hits (probably at the expense of using extra AP). Plus it adds an extra die roll that can have zero impact. Allowing the player to roll 1 dice per hit to see where they all end up, or simply allowing the player to add or deduct 1 from their roll for each successive hit may also work.

Honestly I'd prefer a single page chart for each mech rather than individual cards. It keeps all the data in the same place and doesn't risk getting stuff mixed up. The individual cards would allow for modularity in how you build the mech, but you'd need some way of keeping them all together. E.g. a console to slot the cards into.

You also might want to consider AP tokens to track what you have done over the various sub-turns. Either put tokens on the model cards or on the mini bases themselves.

Finally, you suggest using hex bases. How big should they be and where can you get them? Hexes aren't as common as square and round bases.
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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:52 am

-What is the purpose of the Armour Layer Width?

-It seems to me like you have the basic ARM value, divided by Layer Width to calculate the effective ARM per attack. That is then compared to the PEN value of the gun. If PEN ≧ e.ARM, the inner structure takes damage. If the PEN < e.ARM, the inner structure takes no damage. In both cases, the location's ARM value is reduced, either by PEN or PEN + 1/2 Damage. In which case, is it the basic ARM or the effective ARM.
When PEN >= ARM, the inner structure takes damage equal to [Damage per attack] and the Armour (of Armour/Layer Width) is reduced by PEN.
When PEN < ARM, Armour (not ARM which is Armour/Layer Width) is reduced which in turn will lower the effective ARM down the line.
- What happens when PEN + 1/2 Damage > ARM remaining? Is the excess carried through, or lost?
I should clarify this in the rules. Probably being carried over onto HP.
-What happens if your legs are shot off?
They can no longer use cards that use the C slot such as [Basic Move] and [Charge] which should essentially immobilize that unit.
-On the leg damage card, it says '+1AP cost'. I'm assuming that is for movement purposes only?
Yes, I'm pretty sure I stated that in the section about the component cards and the damage table.
-What happens when two (or more) shots from the same gun strike the same location. Is ARM reduced after the first shot, or are they resolved against the same value?
Each shot should be resolved sequentially so ARM might be reduced due to the first shot.

Thanks for the extremely speedy feedback. Thinking about the rules by myself without showing anyone unfortunately results in a lot of gaps and mistakes, especially given how inexperienced I am with actually writing rules.

I tried to keep the math relatively low but having a tracker does sound better since it would also allow the player to track how much Armour easily by placing a token on the tracker. On that topic, looking back at the rules I seem to have mentioned a lot of different values but not mentioned which ones change and need to be tracked or how to track them.

I've been going back and forth between having 1 page per unit and multiple cards for each body part and at this scale (3v3) multiple cards didn't seem too bad but I agree that it can get troublesome to have to keep track of all the different cards.

I was thinking about the hex bases they make for that model line but since I don't actually own one yet I was not able to provide the dimensions... That is something I 100% missed.

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Jye Nicolson » Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:43 am

Really cool to see progress on this!

It's hard to make specific critiques here because I'm really not in the target audience :lol: The places I'd suggest making changes are clearly deliberate hooks for the complexity you enjoy so it wouldn't be necessarily be helpful.

The one thing I'm wondering about is the *distribution* of the complexity and how it might apply to learning curves. I know you want a fairly chunky game even with Zakus et al, but I'm wondering if it's worth simplifying that tier right down (to the extent of skipping some mechanical hooks because their values have been zeroed or averaged out or whatever) and then ramping up the complexity with more advanced mecha and/or replacing cards through custom parts and pilots via progression.

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Re: Annihilation Zone, a miniatures wargame by Karantu

Post by Karantu » Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:11 am

Jye Nicolson wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:43 am
Really cool to see progress on this!

It's hard to make specific critiques here because I'm really not in the target audience :lol: The places I'd suggest making changes are clearly deliberate hooks for the complexity you enjoy so it wouldn't be necessarily be helpful.

The one thing I'm wondering about is the *distribution* of the complexity and how it might apply to learning curves. I know you want a fairly chunky game even with Zakus et al, but I'm wondering if it's worth simplifying that tier right down (to the extent of skipping some mechanical hooks because their values have been zeroed or averaged out or whatever) and then ramping up the complexity with more advanced mecha and/or replacing cards through custom parts and pilots via progression.
It's been a struggle trying to keep complexity as low as possible while still including all the mechanics that I want in a game. After all, there's no point in making a game if I'm the only one willing to play it, so all feedback is appreciated. The idea of simplifying the base rules by removing stuff like bullet dispersion and re-adding them with more advanced units/weapons is a pretty good idea.

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